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Author Topic: What do you want in an MMO?  (Read 8405 times)

Unorthaparadox

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What do you want in an MMO?
« on: Aug 10, 11, 08:45:01 AM »

Well, I'm sure we've all played our fair share of MMO's here. I know I've poured over every F2P to ever hit the market and about half of the P2P. If you've played any fair amount of time I'm sure you've jumped on their forum to say, "HEY, DO THIS YOU STUPID GAME DESIGNERS!" or "WTF IS ALL THIS ABOUT, N00B". I want to get all of that started beforehand, because that is when it really matters. T.I.M. is all about producing quality. We want to cut down on pointless timesinks, cookie-cutter characters, and slow gameplay. I'm very iffy about really discussing anything related to our specific project's details until things are a little more solidified, but I'll give you the very basic core outline and from there you tell me.

1) What you'd like to see in a MMO that has or hasn't been done before. Let your imaginations run wild.
2)What you DO NOT want to see in an MMO. The things that you hate.
3)Things you've seen in an MMO with potential, but never get used correctly (and how you think it should be applied.
4) And, if you are designing as well, what kind of pitfalls are you wanting to avoid, exploit, or change?

Our game, qworeihoihfoq2iehTITLEHEREkoawhweofihoehfq, is HIGH action HIGH RolePlay VERYHIGH designers HIGH platformer and HIGH othernoncombataspects. Areas are not about just running around AOE'ing 100 mobs every minute. Battles with foes, even just one, are complex and take thought, reaction, and strategy; not just "HIGHEST DPS ATTACK! REPEAT! REPEAT! REPEAT! REPEAT!. Levels are built to challenge the player and draw on his skill, not just his skills (BigDog ;) ) Anyways, that's all I really want to discuss because I'm no master of HE yet, but I have been working out this system for a long time now and I'm 100% sure HE can handle it flawlessly. Just want new ideas though. I know what I hate and want to avoid or add, but what about you?
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HE-ANDY

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Re: What do you want in an MMO?
« Reply #1 on: Aug 10, 11, 09:07:12 AM »

I go at "what do I want from an MMO" from a different perspective.

I work for HeroEngine.  I *know* I suck at game design.  What I think about is, when I play the only (graphic) MMO I've ever liked, Final Fantasy: XI, is how I could implement the various game systems they've done.  And then my appreciation grows for the designers who thought of it, and did it, because it is all intimately tied together.

And fun.
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Bear

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Re: What do you want in an MMO?
« Reply #2 on: Aug 10, 11, 09:08:02 AM »

I would like to see someone pull off a game with as much consistent GM interaction as EQ Legends had at its height, and The Matrix Online had at the beginning.   I'd imagine that a small development team would need to launch that sort of thing in a very small region and provide in-game GM service during a window during the evening to begin with, so the game itself would need to be compelling enough to keep players busy during the off-hours.

I imagine this serving a niche market, but I would easily pay in excess of $50 a month (which is what Legends cost) just to play such a game, and so would a lot of other RP nerds.   :D
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Jim_Wellington

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Re: What do you want in an MMO?
« Reply #3 on: Aug 10, 11, 09:52:23 AM »

-I want to develop Wounded NPCs for healers to work on.
-I want a world where Artisan characters (2nd class/occupation?) could make swords, armour (spiders weave spidersilk armor) 'builders' could either actually be designers or hand a designer an idea and after a suitable delay, the player who commisssion the house/mansion/whatever could move in with his/her own key and have a whole lot of new places to stash stuff. Also: wagon makers could sell wagons so you can load up with more booty than you can carry and magickers can sell you a charm that will render your wagon invisible to thieves (and then sell a charm to thieves to see those invisible wagons and things. I'd like to make it possible for 'peace-loving' characters to earn a decent living and get experience in their guilds and advance and stuff like that. (I worked out the dice roll routine for low level swordsmiths to 'craft' swords a long time ago, just wasn't linked to a visible sword. ((those who specialize can make uber swords, or armor, or whatever)) a lot sooner than those who dabble in a little of everything.)).)
-Um, I think I mentioned it somewhere else, I want to have different areas for different types of people. Rabid PvP people would have their own city. People who want to play at being royalty, looking down their noses at rabble, could hang out at the palace. designers could have characters in a city I was calling 'Oblivia' (they didn't really know there was any more to the world than their own little city?, but since a couple of you pointed out that Pokemon might own the name my best artist thought "Absentia" would be a great name for a city full of crafts people who would have merchant-agents bring their amazingly beautiful new outfits, hairdos, etc. to the ready customers with tons of gold and other booty to trade.
-My bards can open wild portals (that might be tough on GMs, but cool for customers. Bard sends a call out to a gm, "Hey, I got three characters here who want a lift to the castle, one of them's a pain in the butt, can you zoom Brigette and Aardvark to the castle and dump Poopferbrains in the swamp somewhere, when he yells for help tell him you're busy- and portals sometimes go wrong, that's why we call them 'wild portals'. ((there might actually be an easier way to do that-))

I have a poll whose link was posted under "Goals/what we're working on" here, it's more for customers than other developers: I lost a bunch of results when I lost the password to an earlier version: give this a shot: http://www.surveymonkey.com/s/QFD6RTN

~~~Oh man, don't ask me about ideas, one silly personality test I took somewhere said my working style is that of an Evokateur. I grab dreams and translate them into something other people can appreciate. ((also, my thinking style is "visionary" and my emotional style is "Empath" or "Scintillator" (depending on the phase of the moon?) When I'm an Empath the Empath part is in charge of trying to keep the rest of me coherent)).

(That's probably enough damage for one post...)

---thanks,

~~~~~Jim
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Jim_Wellington

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Re: What do you want in an MMO?
« Reply #4 on: Aug 16, 11, 04:53:12 AM »

I also want to have a race with varying shaped heads and stuff (they claim to be assembled from spare parts) who can have webbed feet, maybe reversed knees, useless wings; pointed, square, round, or triangular head shapes, horns?

They will also be able to light cigars and start campfires with their 'firebreath spells' (that should annoy loads of other characters because they'll have to practice a lot to get the spells to a strength where they can do damage in combat)

I'm also going to have a nearly invisible race (this one's a challenge) (have a 7 foot tall wavering tree trunk with vague features wandering around?) They'll need to either enslave npcs (who will run away the first chance they get) or inspire npcs (with healing spells and feel-good spells) to help them get any booty they earn to market place because they won't be able to pick anything up.

-----Jim
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jcsmith562

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Re: What do you want in an MMO?
« Reply #5 on: Aug 16, 11, 07:31:26 AM »

I want a world that feels like a world, rather than a Choose Your Own Adventure book.
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Stadi_Thompson

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Re: What do you want in an MMO?
« Reply #6 on: Aug 17, 11, 05:46:04 PM »

what JC said. while Rift Aion and WOW are very good games IMO, the progression feels like a pre scripted path. everyone does the same quest, usually at the same level. Playing those games a second time through once you max level is not to fun at times, at that point it's time to wait for another content update. I don't think I ever played a game twice after beating it since the days of Contra and Super Mario Brothers. Give me some random generated quest so when I level my next toon it's not the exact repeat with different abilities/skills.
« Last Edit: Aug 17, 11, 05:54:12 PM by info360covers »
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Bear

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Re: What do you want in an MMO?
« Reply #7 on: Aug 17, 11, 10:26:05 PM »

This is pretty abstract, but: I would like see an MMO where I am literally expected to spend half or more of my time socializing.  Not necessarily because the game rewards you for it, but because occasionally venturing out to beat something down and spending the rest of your time schmoozing seems more like what I would actually be doing if I were an adventurer, and because the game (somehow) plays out in such a way that you don't feel like you have to max out your level/stats in order to "win" or even "play."

(The "how do you manage that?!?!!!" is really the devil in the details, amirite?)
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Jim_Wellington

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Re: What do you want in an MMO?
« Reply #8 on: Aug 18, 11, 04:05:08 AM »

Bear, What we did in the old days (text games) was banter back and forth on the Psi channel (more than one couple met and got married (in the real world).) then  people playing games more lately would keep an aim messenger window open, or, if they have a really good connection, skype. some games have an ooc channel. In game elders held in game chats in virtual cafe's & bars. if second life could handle cncerts, there are simple solutions.
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Stadi_Thompson

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Re: What do you want in an MMO?
« Reply #9 on: Aug 18, 11, 06:06:20 PM »

Jim you ever play Rafermand it was a MUD?
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WoE-Byron

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Re: What do you want in an MMO?
« Reply #10 on: Aug 18, 11, 07:20:20 PM »

My opinion is in a video game... Everything should have a reason and/or purpose.
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Blackhawk

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Re: What do you want in an MMO?
« Reply #11 on: Aug 22, 11, 05:34:33 AM »

It looks like a lot of people are after much the same thing, I'll toss my two coins to Charon and see where the boat ride goes.

I'm looking at creating a game world where every single player has the opportunity to be a GM, if they so choose. This world will start out pretty rough and will be slowly populated by creations of the actual players. Like a wiki it will grow and be tempered by it's very audience. You won't feel driven to grind mobs for new petty possessions, but rather grind hardcore story-telling in order to gain community respect and the right to tell new stories.

In short, I want a world bubbling with life, not filled with idiots bunny hopping at the mail box near the AH. I want to be part of a renowned group, and not be seen as just another Paladin in Light-bringer. I want to spend my evening with my friends moving through a new story arc, taking on new foes, not killing them for the 25th cooldown because the newest member wants some cheap drop.

I have an original idea, and a decent starting point. I have 30 years of programming experience, raid leading, story-telling and good old 20 sided die dungeon mastering. I'm looking for people who have their own ideas, drive, passion - who share a base and want to exchange ideas, implementations and even work in each others worlds...who knows, maybe they're the same world.

My base world will be known as Clothos - the spinner of threads. It is here that the technology and ideas will first be given form. I envisage Clothos as being small, but potent, like a mother.

Clothos will be built on the foundation of Hero Engine. On top of that will be layers and basic implementations of things - such as:

  • Chat System
  • Skills based combat
  • Skills based crafting
  • No level system to break apart groups and friends
  • Optionally an AA system
  • Justice System (prison, etc)
  • Role based management of the world
  • Questing System
  • Inventory / Bags
  • Buddhist teaching
  • Karma System
  • Buddhist path of progression (non-combat)
  • Hand to hand combat
  • Three unique races (assuming you haven't seen the Dark Crystal!)
  • Campaign system

Let me know if any of that sounds interesting to you. With my long years of coding, putting together screens and systems will be...um...not so hard :D

I'll be looking to find others to assist me in creating my base world. I have no 3D skills worth speaking of, except to say that I can spell it. I know at an abstract level ways to create topography, and from years of game playing smart ways to put it together - but that's not the same as being able to madly hack it all out on the tools. I'll be very interested in finding others who share my vision and want a place to spend their energy.

Finally, about money, this is not about money. If people want to play for free then I want them to as well. If they want to toss a few dollars in a hat then I'll make sure there's one for the coppers to land inside.

Want to play a game?
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Jim_Wellington

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Re: What do you want in an MMO?
« Reply #12 on: Aug 22, 11, 03:55:38 PM »

Hi, Bear, No, sorry I never visited that Mud, Can you tell us what was good or not so good about it otr ny other game you were involved with?
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WoE-Byron

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Re: What do you want in an MMO?
« Reply #13 on: Aug 30, 11, 08:49:11 PM »

I want a game that is not just another World of Warcraft clone.

I want a game that is more based around the players ability to think and react then about how many monsters they can grind.

I want a game that is full of immersion and keeps the player on his/her toes at all times.

I want a game that is always dynamically changing who/what has ownership of areas of the game.

I want a game that is focused around guild mechanics but does not force you to be in the guild.

If you would like to see these things also then watch for our game as we have a plan that will achieve this. :)
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Taschenmogul

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Re: What do you want in an MMO?
« Reply #14 on: Aug 31, 11, 08:10:27 AM »

I can at least say what I donīt want in an MMO, and it seems that many others think alike.
When I look around I see more and more games getting dumbed down, some of them getting designed to squeeze as much money out of its players as possible.
As we all know, games are getting dumbed down to reach more possible players, to also reach those players that either are overwhelmed by more complex gameplay or that just want a game thatīs easy to understand and quick to play, a "casual" game.
This all is understandable, especially for those that work or plan to work as game developers - you somehow have to pay your rent.

On the other hand it is all that I hate in a game.
When I played Diablo 2 I quickly begin to dislike this endless and stupid spiral of having to find better items to kill harder monsters just to get your hands on even better items that enabled you to kill even harder monsters.
Sadly that sort of gameplay is what is propagated more and more.

So for our game we donīt want that.
We donīt want characters to become exponentially more powerful when they level up, we donīt want items giving ludicrous bonuses just to keep up with the always-getting-harder enemies.
And we certainly donīt want real-money traps like that in some bleed-to-play (I think they are called "free-to-play" officially) games.
For me this also has a moral side and I really could go on and on about this and get really angry.

As an example - I recently searched the web for BigPoint's new bleed-to-play MMO "Drakensang Online".
I stumbled across a forum post where someone talked about having spent 100 Euros for some fill in generic name here-achievement/item/quest/whatchacallit in just ONE DAY for the game "Dark Orbit".
100 Euros! In just a day!
And we all know that those people exist. We all know that there are people who have a lot more time than money and still spend this money on basically meaningless game-"advancements".
And among those people are people who, on top of that, easily fall for gambling and will spend all they have (and more) on things like "lucky crates" that you can buy in some games and that with a chance of one in a million will give you that special cool item.

That sort of gameplay is not gameplay that takes the player by the hand and leads him through a world of wonder that the developers made for the player, with passion.
Itīs not a game for the player at all, itīs a game against the player.
And I despise that very strongly, on grounds of principle.
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