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Author Topic: Star Wars: The Old Republic  (Read 12659 times)

TGSRofar

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Re: Star Wars: The Old Republic
« Reply #30 on: Jan 25, 12, 04:54:17 PM »

Everyone is entitled to their opinions so I will voice mine.  I think it is a well done game that is fun to play.
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Ron Farrell
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DragonFist

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Re: Star Wars: The Old Republic
« Reply #31 on: Jan 26, 12, 12:35:17 PM »

I haven't gotten into the end game yet and I certainly don't think it is a perfect game but the story telling quest system is above and beyond anything I've seen in any MMO I've played.

As long as they keep adding more to it, I can predict that they'll be profitable for some time.
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Stadi_Thompson

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Re: Star Wars: The Old Republic
« Reply #32 on: Feb 16, 12, 04:53:24 PM »

There will always be mixed reviews about TOR. I think it boils down to rather you are bored of playing WOW themeparks, or if you hunger for a sandbox like Archage. TOR is a themepark, at this point a lot of avid mmo players are bored with the idea of kill 10 of these, deliver this to mr.x, collect 10 of these, then rinse and repeat with diff mobs. You can only do that for so many years in so many games before deja vu starts to sinks in. When production began on TOR, WOW was the hot topic, 6 years later after everyone and their mother has a level 70 paladin it's not as appealing. I think the mmo genre evolved big time during TOR's production cycle. I stand neutral on my opinions about the game as I am not into themeparks at all anymore.
« Last Edit: Feb 16, 12, 05:03:17 PM by Stadi_Thompson »
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DarkOm3n

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Re: Star Wars: The Old Republic
« Reply #33 on: Mar 09, 12, 01:16:59 PM »

I have to agree with Stadi. I cancelled my subscription after experiencing the end game. Was a fun levelling game but in the end it's another WoW, Rift, GW or what have you which was fun back in 04. ;)

I do have a related question though, PLEASE tell me the loading screen issues are their problem and not HE's ;) lol sorry joking there.
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ProjectDiomedes

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Re: Star Wars: The Old Republic
« Reply #34 on: Mar 29, 12, 03:16:18 AM »

I'll chime in here, since I'm currently playing SWTOR.  It's a very good game for what it is, an advanced Themepark.  And, when judged in that realm, it does a fine job overall.   That's not to say that the game doesn't have some serious flaws.  Forgive my verbosity here, unlike Zork, I don't have a /brief command line. 

Now, a short disclaimer here, I want to see what the Update in April brings to the game and how it's executed, so I do reserve the right to revisit this later.

What SWTOR does very well is story telling, and for a theme park game it actually has some of the deepest character development story lines around.  It's sad that currently they do nothing with it.  It's also pretty clear that SWTOR was set up for the casual gamer, at least up until the end game.  and even then from what I've experienced it's pretty casual compared to a lot of MMO's I've played over the years.  The companion system, is a mixed bag of results.  I love the interaction between the characters and the companion characters, but I loathe the crafting system.  But it's nice to see every class have a "pet" and it's also nice to be able to send them off to sell off the grey gear, though I wish you could set it to sell off green gear too.

But, in my opinion SWTOR has a couple of major flaws in it's design.  The first of which is it's way too easy to level quickly.  They did such a marvelous job creating this rich story environment, but unless you want to hang around killing zero EXP creatures you'll bypass 60-70% of the content.  Which, if I may diverge here briefly, makes me ask the question.  If your going to make it so easy to level that even a fairly casual player can max level in a month, why bother having levels at all?  Wouldn't it be better to go to a leveless system at that point and devote all the encounter space generated towards that end?  Not proposing that by the way, just seems like a waste to have 60-70% of your developed material go unplayed because players leveled past it so quickly.

Fast leveling also leads to two other problems.  The first of which is players spend so much time soloing, and leveling quickly doing so, that they seldom group, and if they do it's only for 5 or 10 minutes to kill a boss somewhere.  I took my toon to level 50 in 4 weeks playing 2-3 hours a day on average.  And I wasn't even trying, sad part is I only grouped 2 times from levels 1-49.  So fast leveling doesn't develop community within a game, atleast not in this structure. 

The other part is, people get bored very quickly at 50 in the game, which is why I suspect subsciption numbers will fall. I know most of my guild has already pretty much stopped playing, though most of them are still technically subscribers until the end of the billing cycle and a few are on hiatus waiting for the update to see if it's worth staying in game. 

But overall I agree with Stadi and Dark, when push comes to shove it's just another, easier, version of wow.  Not that there's anything wrong with that, per se, it's the current trend.  Sadly until a non WoW type game breaks the 1,000,000 mark the major trend will stay that way.
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LastJudge

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Re: Star Wars: The Old Republic
« Reply #35 on: Mar 29, 12, 04:34:12 AM »

I played SWTOR during the free weekend. And I must say I liked it (at least the early-game content as with free weekend you can't go past lvl 15). As I'm not a fan of writing a huge wall of text, I'll try to sum up.

pros:
+ lot of quests to choose from (although I skipped many of them, I feel like I had very good range of choice and wasn't forced to do every single quest in an area)
+ companions (it's nice to send them away to sell my grey items, but I'd like to somehow tell them what items to sell so I can get rid of some better quality items as well. they are also of great help while exping and fighting)
+ dialogs with NPCs
+ no need to corpse-run, can resurrect where I died or resurrect at the nearest place I discovered or something like that
+ environment (I haven't seen everything obviously, but I liked most of what I saw)
+ spaceship battles (with weekend pass I couldn't try it, but it sounds pretty cool)

cons:
- exping goes fast (I don't like fast exping so much, especially when there's a lot of good early and mid-game content to enjoy)
- battlegrounds seemed somewhat chaotic to me

mixed:
? no need to group (I didn't need group as I was doing solo quests - but this is also good for players that like playing solo more than in group)
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ProjectDiomedes

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Re: Star Wars: The Old Republic
« Reply #36 on: Mar 29, 12, 07:32:12 PM »

I don't know, the lack of any sort of real death penalty kind of bothers me.  I can zerg a number of quests solo that I shouldn't be able to complete solo, just by dying, running past the mob reviving on the spot, and repeating this as often as necessary to get to the goal item.  One daily quest comes to mind that gives me 2 daily tokens for a 15 minute, two suicide death run.  Death penalties shouldn't be draconian, but too little and there is no feeling of risk and reward.

As for soloing, I made it to 50 in 4 weeks, playing an average of 3 hours a day.  I think I grouped twice in that time frame for a total of about 30 minutes, and then just so we weren't competing for the same spawns.

Agree fully on the fast leveling statement, as I mentioned in my LOONG post there's no feeling of accomplishment and so much rich material was bypassed because players level past it so quickly.  I figure at least 50-60% of the content gets bypassed.  Players like me go back to get the "accomplishments" but frankly doing it while killing Grey mobs isn't much fun at all.

after playing SWTOR for about 2 months now, I'd give it a C- total grade.  If you'd asked me to grade it while I was leveling I probably would have given it a A- or B+ ..but it's never a good sign when players are bored in the game 2 months after release.
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HE-Cooper

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Re: Star Wars: The Old Republic
« Reply #37 on: Mar 29, 12, 08:09:44 PM »

This is really not the place for 2 page diatribes on a specific game, what exactly it is for, I'm not sure :-) but I just dot want threads devolving into opinion flame battles.
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ProjectDiomedes

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Re: Star Wars: The Old Republic
« Reply #38 on: Mar 29, 12, 09:17:56 PM »

Sorry, didn't mean to move this in a flamewar direction.  But, when discussing the pro's and con's of a game there are going to be some differences of opinion on game play.  The ultimate judge of a game though will remain what happens to the game long term, and so far you can't sneeze at SWTOR's succes with 1.7 million subscribers at last report.  The question, both commercially and academically, is how well the game is doing after it's been out for 3-6 months and how well the design holds on to players.  And in the end, academic arguments aside, from a business standpoint that is all that matters. 

But I will apologize if I'm overly emphatic in praising or talking down on a game.  I'm very passionate about gaming, and my statements tend to get colored by that passion.  with that I'll shut up now :) 
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Ashmun

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Re: Star Wars: The Old Republic
« Reply #39 on: May 08, 12, 06:37:39 PM »

Some really great textures and details in this game.  Also the depth in world design and HSL is pretty astonishing. (for a theme-park)

Anyone else notice that a player can actually translate the "text" used on various things into actual words if you looked online?  :)
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Lattam

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Re: Star Wars: The Old Republic
« Reply #40 on: May 22, 12, 11:27:13 AM »

As this game itself was not my particular cup of tea, this is definitely inspiring for everyone who is currently working on HE and the possibilities.
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Prometheus2012

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Re: Star Wars: The Old Republic
« Reply #41 on: Sep 30, 12, 12:47:34 PM »

As this game itself was not my particular cup of tea, this is definitely inspiring for everyone who is currently working on HE and the possibilities.

It would also be nice if we all had 100 million dollar budgets as well :( As a former player of ToR, i havnt let their failiure turn me off using the hero engine.

ProjectDiomedes

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Re: Star Wars: The Old Republic
« Reply #42 on: Nov 19, 12, 01:27:38 PM »

I don't think 100 million is needed to produce a good solid game.  I've read some of the development blogs that have been made available over the year, or at least second hand accountings of some of them along with interviews of the developers.  One thing that struck me was how bloated they were in the early stages of development.  I don't recall who the interview was with but he was stating how early in the process they were just adding people from all over the place and it got to where noone knew what the others were doing. 

Which should be a warning sign for developers, not regarding to how good the game will be in the end, but rather regarding adding too many cooks early in the project and how so much in the way of resources are wasted in the early stages of development.  The design team behind SWTOR isn't the only example of this, but it is probably the most extreme example.

Personally I think the best way to start with any game is a small team of people to work out what the game should look like, should play like, and what the end goal will be.  Then once that is all set pretty well start adding members to the team as needed. 

But of course the ideal seldom works unless your self financed, when backing money from outside investers enter in to the equation that all changes.  But what do I know, two funding options have fallen off our table to date, but that's life in the indie world :)

But that is all off of the SWTOR track...I'm still a subscriber to the game, though I don't know why as I haven't played it in 2 months.  I guess I keep hoping they'll make changes that makes the end game more interesting.

I'll say conceptually it's a good game, but it has a couple of design flaws which I think developers can learn from.  Perhaps the one that stands out most is the fully voice acting in the game.  On the surface this sounded like a great idea, but the problem is it really slows down the expansion and added content process and increases the cost of the added content.  To keep players interested in a theme park type game you really need to keep adding new player content on a frequent basis and that added layer I think hampers that aspect of the game in terms of new play areas, new characters, new quest lines, etc. 

Despite my criticisms of the game the fact I kept playing it means there was something enjoyable about it, it's really not a bad game by any real measure.  It just has a few flaws which killed it's longer term viability.   
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Prometheus2012

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Re: Star Wars: The Old Republic
« Reply #43 on: Nov 20, 12, 11:36:37 AM »

Conceptually a good game? They cloned wow (poorly) and put a different skin on it. ToR was a failure from the start IMO. Im not saying it was because its based on hero engine....just really really poor design and no innovation whatsoever.
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